I think defects are part and parcel of any purchase, and still acceptable because hearsay they are under warranty? I'm only slightly concerned with the products.
I'm more deeply concerned with the cover up. Why ah and prease cum cream.
And the funny thing is, they already knew that there will be major recall of most the newest train and will need many years to repair. The ceo of smrt continue to earn big bonus and also paycheck keep increase for the next few years. Justifiable meh? Ceo will also be partly at fault as end of the day it is the mission that drives how the company worked and the tender process that involved so much money he also need to approved right?
Who want to bet, next they'll enact a law to ban drones flying over the port area, SG's very own no-fly exclusive zone.
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Or maybe deploy AA guns there to shoot down the drones.
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I think it is already illegal long ago. I have been told by a police officer many years ago to stop flying and that it is illegal to photograph or take videos of private property unless I have permission. If protected area, I guess even harder to get permission to fly over legally. That was so long ago that there was no such thing as gopro and I had a point-and-shoot camera mounted on my rc plane. Lol.
Why after so many complaints, smrt still very much the same?
Everything's falling on deaf ears
One word: hopeless
Hearsay they got 69%support
Lol...Wah this saga is more than meets the eye. I will follow like a hawk to understand why there is a cover up
Meanwhile as a good citizen, I will pray that our old JDM trains continue to hold fort ��
And car-lite has to postpone to 2023 liao ��
Eh 15july going MU bo? No excuse hor near u place haaa
Impurities of the material - this is exactly the same cause of the sagging and snapping power cable in Circle or NE Line.
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QC inspections done at KTV!� Or no random samplings.
any defects or complaints can be settled during KTV and Sauna sessionssssssss ... (plural) .... lolImpurities of the material - this is exactly the same cause of the sagging and snapping power cable in Circle or NE Line.
QC inspections done at KTV! Or no random samplings.
Edited by Wt_know, 06 July 2016 - 12:35 PM.
Had a late morning nap and heard these whispers in my dreams, or rather nightmare : "...Cracks and Defects will happen from tum to tum(whats so funny?). Afterall, still got China Warranty ah...","If a mistake is made, prease cum cream and admit it, dont cover up...","in the olden dayz, the CEO of simisai will stand in front of shareholders, bow and harakiri with his samurai sword..","this is not flooding, or ponding, but is cracking...dont worry orchard loot is safe...","the defects are not life threatening, but your lives are..". �After that my erection came and woke up.
Where's the independent audit?
Why never point to the ceiling point to the floor?
Where's the call for harikiri.?
Where's the non stop parliament drama?
Whets all the ministers taking turn to say lp things?
He praying for his next job la.. the next meal ticket. One that will be totally untouchable and unaccountable to anyone for any screw ups.aiya ... that CEO only come out for "good" events ...
when got problem always practice SAF survival skill #1 ... take cover ...
he be SMRT CEO better lah ... imagine if we had a war and he had to lead SAF ...
He must maintain a dignified appearance... the GRC spot waiting come next election. Maybe even become minister ..
let's wait for the 100 days zero downtime buffet ... huat ah!
Be careful of aluminium...
when it breaks, it does without any warning unlike metal or steel where there are signs prior to the breakage.
I got a nasty deep cut due to the aluminium handle breaking off suddenly when I opened a HDB flat window one day.
Like that our normal bread and butter cars how? Aeroplane frame how?
Luckily the crack trains still got warranty if not the next budget for the COE will be doubled...�
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Who know? Perhaps those no warranty parts have already shipped out few months ago???
We must thank the whistle blowers or the engineers who found the defect.
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However, sometimes they are muzzled by management.
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Long time ago, I worked in a company testing a certain pcb.
The tech was complaining about difficulty to put screws into a box.
I checked and found the box was slightly out of shape, not square, and not within spec.
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I refer back to my boss, the supervisor, But he had good relations with the QC people, esp the gals, and downplay the whole thing.
The QC dept was sleeping and I had no choice but to kick up a ruckus, bcuz it was affecting our operations.
Luckily I left not too long after.
I got a question about the timeline of the story. The report claims that these problems were discovered in late 2011 and was even suspected as the cause of the breakdowns in Dec.
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In December 2011, serious malfunctions occurred on the SMRT�s North South Line, which the SMRT suspected were caused by C151A trains. A subcontractor responsible for supplying train components to CSR Sifang admitted to FactWire that after the malfunctions, SMRT significantly reduced the frequency of C151A trains and asked to delay payment for extra trains of the same series, greatly impacting the subcontractor�s cash flow.
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If this is the case, then why did they still place an order of 35 new trains (C151B) to the same bloody manufacturer in Aug 2012????
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And just last year, they ordered another 12 trains (presumably to the same manufacturer as well).....
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maybe in the AAR he will be asking why never camo the trains like this during the movement? kena spotted liao...
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should have used CB leaf right ?�
![[:p]](https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/blogger_img_proxy/AEn0k_vROAPRMmqgod7oI2XlI7IfxlA2cXUpH-RQxjxS3UKCDdBX6yRaamUKVnPocbX8mMsUy0HOcmAWjaQScEoUDcpGpO3T4tlo3kQjJxLBVNZRBDH_ENMZh5Qw-3ywAudUTH8mzKBg9Is=s0-d)
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bestest camoflage in SAF ... �
![[thumbsup]](https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/blogger_img_proxy/AEn0k_upBIYe3oZ7p4p_8XfScqb9bbq_eCMRxcotbPL6TG61Gxm9l-6eoF7-cK-Rv8CjDNarhUPM8kp6H2G6G86XSB5a55wYZZLXVVAEdepsxOUTPwUWSIxqvLiroszi4Gh7aPzQcVo1ag2j=s0-d)
Edited by Blueray, 06 July 2016 - 03:12 PM.
Still no news from the CEO of SMRT...
What's the point of having this post when he ain't coming out to clarify ...
As head of the family, it's his duty to come out and protect the family .. And not just sit there waiting for food ($) to gobble in ....
Anyway, with the "release" of these new but defective trains back to China, we are back to shortage of trains ... Be prepared for longer wait and more trains breakdown due to stress on these trains ....
And then with car-lite mentality, high coe and parking, more crowds will be at the platform waiting for trains ... And then they will increase fare during the next review to justify the maintenance and more $ into the pockets ...
Haiz....
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Dont complain lah hehehe
I can complain cos this is our Singaporean asset ...
Now, would the govt listen? Haiz ...
this one no courtesy train mah...
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haha ... even if gib courtesy train who dare to take ?�
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unless its 50% off for fare but SMRT siam all liability if something happens ...�
![[sly]](https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/blogger_img_proxy/AEn0k_vXbZ_7iKwQgDkFlOkOAZprFG978VbxaIbGL33AOsyk7pE2gq-qpsWQav9YLgCs_0UeprqAf660ienVbWis7Hi_F2zn6EWBZwNXONeY_LWQrTj4XvGeGsAd3imJDPu5Cr7vTiA=s0-d)
I can complain cos I am Singaporean ...
I can complain cos this is our Singaporean asset ...
Now, would the govt listen? Haiz ...
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Our heart is pure and our loyalty is unquestionable. But these people think they really own Singapore and treat our country like their assets and citizens and residents like pawn for them to use and manipulate.�
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Dont bother too much, let nature take its course.�
New saga!�CSR Sifang submitted fake test data to LTA?!
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New saga! CSR Sifang submitted fake test data to LTA?!
Searching through the Internet, it has been found that one year ago, an insider had already whistle-blown on CSR Sifang for doctoring its test data of the C151A train trial. CSR Sifang entered into a joint venture with the Japanese Kawasaki group to develop the C151A trains, which were later bought by SMRT.
The person blogged about it on Sina.com last year (4 Feb 2015): http://blog.sina.cn/...a50102vdd9.html
He signed off with the words �???� (please spread the news). He recounted that CSR Sifang had fabricated test data of the train trial illegally. The bogus data was then submitted to Kawasaki heavy Industries and Singapore�s LTA.
Apparently, in Nov 2010, the first trial train manufactured by CSR Sifang was unable to meet the strict specifications laid down by Kawasaki. The insider alleged that large number of CSR Sifang officials then conspired together to fabricate the test results of the train trial. The insider had listed a large number of names of the CSR Sifang officials in his blog, alleged to have participated in the large scam.
The insider said, �Because I have also personally involved in the fabrication of data, which would gravely affect the quality and safety (of the trains), I always felt guilty. If the trains quality and safety were compromised abroad, it would affect the country�s reputation.� (?????????????????????????????????????????????????????)
Checking through the Internet, some of the names mentioned by the insider can, indeed, still be found in the company, CSR Sifang.
The insider said that evidence of data fabrication can be found inside the email correspondence among the many CSR Sifang officials. Furthermore, he mentioned that the test report submitted to LTA was different from the one kept in CSR Sifang.
Weibo blog asks public to boycott CSR Sifang
On another Chinese blog site, Weibo, someone has also published a blog about CSR Sifang fabricating test data of the C151A trains. This was also written 1 year ago on 21 Feb 2015 (http://www.weibo.com...812636453147191). The author asked the public to boycott the company.
In the blog, he mentioned that CSR Sifang had altered the test data during the trial of the first train. Many of numbers in the test data submitted to its partner Kawasaki heavy Industries and Singapore�s LTA was different from the ones kept by CSR Sifang.
He accused CSR Sifang of being shameless and thick-skinned, a disgrace to the Chinese.
He also mentioned employees being �abused� inside the company. For example, employees can be randomly removed from his post, salaries can be lowered, staff can be forced to undertake a different job, switch departments as well as receive different benefits. Also, their annual performance pay can be arbitrarily deducted.
If the allegation is true, it can only mean that employees working in CSR Sifang must be very demoralized.
http://theindependen...st-data-to-lta/
Oh no.. Now jia lat lao. What will LTA do? Sue them? That may explain the start of the major breakdown in end of year 2011 before that no issue. We as commenter just Bo Bian lor.. Lan lan sub thumb..
many grades lah...
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just like some sports rims will crack upon hitting stones, some won't. A major hit in pothole at the strategic location will render most sports rims cracked, but not steel rims.
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These are alloys with different composition and are different for different parts of cars, aeroplanes, space shuttles....
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Like that our normal bread and butter cars how? Aeroplane frame how?
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Where did the qualities go??? Mia!?
Maybe he was simply the wrong man for the job. .
Maybe they should have ask Saw to go command the SAF instead of the other way round.
Wrong from day one as many have suspected?
Anyway, pretty sure they will just remain silence and then eventually will say Let's Move On ....
Only when one serious accident then they will address and start the blame game
Attached Thumbnails
Edited by Toothiewabbit, 06 July 2016 - 05:59 PM.
It's an honourable mistake.
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Looks like the can has opened so big that there are lots of worms coming out now.....
Anyway, pretty sure they will just remain silence and then eventually will say Let's Move On ....
Only when one serious accident then they will address and start the blame game
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I quoted before taking a HDB lift is a nightmare now come to taking the train is also a nightmare...
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�Scary man- can explose
�It is very unusual for cracks to appear in new components, and you don�t know how much pressure it can withstand after that, because running puts a lot of pressure on the train�s car body,� said Lai. �If [the incidents] are true, aside from cracks, battery explosions also reflect that the product may have quality issues. The quality control of the entire manufacturing process comes under suspicion, causing people to lose confidence in the product.�
"
Penny wise Pound Foolish- want cheap n good- where got such thing. But fare increase leh- how?
BIG headlights too?
The same goes for our buses. I still prefer the old nissan UD series buses in the 1990s. The seats were more comfortable and the width of the walkway to the seats are wider. There are also no high steps leading to the last row unlike the new merc citaro buses, something which I find irritating as it is also a safety hazard for the middle seat last row . Imagine being thrown off when the driver e brake. Hence they provide seat belt.The first few batches, made by Kawasaki and Siemens, are still in very good condition. When it was due for refurbishment around 2006, some were found to have performed so much better than expected that they delayed the programme by a year or two.
It was only later that we got Alstom, Bombardier, and China Sifang, whose products aren't so good.
It is also common to see the new citaro buses emit black smoke despite the so called adblue solution to reduce diesel emissions .
can lemon law kick in to refund all the cheapo trains
2019? Heng ah.!...just in time before..!.Ministry of transport had clarifed, the 1St batch of repair will be down amd delivered by year 2019 not 2023. Hmm..
Maybe my theory still proved correct, train too heavy, so now they sent back to the manufacturer to find ways to reduce train weight thats why need so long. It's like total rebuild of the train not just repair. Repair need so long meh?
I think the next step LTA should do is to periodically send people down to manufacture company to spot check on the progress on repair. Caught them off guard and to see their work procedure. If there is something wrong can straightaway lecture them and said if you continue to do this sloppy work or doing things short cut, I am not going to pay you $ and accept delivery. You bankrupt is your problem. This will at least force these people to do the job properly. Since we can't withdraw from it totally as got train being delivered and no choice have to stick to it.
Will there be a debate? Will Vivian come clean?
They've been hoist on their own petard regarding transperancy that's for sure.
Any heads to roll over this?
I think LTA try to cover up cos this incident fugging malu ...
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tio scam by china ...
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Politically, I think covering up is bad strategy.
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Given the strong anti-China sentiments around the world these days, they could have come clean and blamed it on CSR Sifang. There will be some disquiet about LTA going for price over quality, but nothing like the saga they are facing today.
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The thought of our officials having to protect other country reputation even after getting fleeced disgusts me.
Edited by Alheych, 06 July 2016 - 11:12 PM.
Politically, I think covering up is bad strategy.
Given the strong anti-China sentiments around the world these days, they could have come clean and blamed it on CSR Sifang. There will be some disquiet about LTA going for price over quality, but nothing like the saga they are facing today.
Cannot leh...best of friends and we need to rely on them more than they need us
Cannot leh...best of friends and we need to rely on them more than they need us
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I am aware of the political reality of how big they are and how small we are.
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But the way LTA has behaved does not ensure our national interest. It sends the signal that we can be bullied and we will swallow it.
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It doesn't have to be diplomatic, just commercial - sorry but your products suck so we won't buy them anymore until you buck up.
Edited by Alheych, 06 July 2016 - 11:19 PM.
LTA just play with your COE numbers, and they can get back all that they lost.
I am aware of the political reality of how big they are and how small we are.
But the way LTA has behaved does not ensure our national interest. It sends the signal that we can be bullied and we will swallow it.
It doesn't have to be diplomatic, just commercial - sorry but your products suck so we won't buy them anymore until you buck up.
Such secretive behaviours really cmi, really sending wrong signals
Cannot leh...best of friends and we need to rely on them more than they need us
�U really hit the nail- never mind lose one battle but overall more win than lose- OK what-
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so many projects in China- cannot turn face otherwise kick singapore out for urban building project- then we all eat grass.
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anyway it is a done deal- complain for what- just move on and hopefully rectify the problem.
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Just an honest mistake lor- suck thumb again.�
�U really hit the nail- never mind lose one battle but overall more win than lose- OK what-
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so many projects in China- cannot turn face otherwise kick singapore out for urban building project- then we all eat grass.
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anyway it is a done deal- complain for what- just move on and hopefully rectify the problem.
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Just an honest mistake lor- suck thumb again.�
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Willing to swallow not enough. Have to be street smart also. Part of this street smart is showing that we know our stuff.
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Otherwise, based on past experience, give us urban building project we still eat grass. And that was not just anyone, it was the old man himself.
Edited by Alheych, 06 July 2016 - 11:35 PM.
ownself cover ownself
ownself answer ownself
ownself reflect ownself
let's move on!
Edited by Wt_know, 06 July 2016 - 11:58 PM.
Well summarized!Actually I feel that LTA is doing a good job. They did ownself check ownself, found out the problem and tried to find a solution themselves. They don't need to answer to the public because 70% have given them the mandate to ownself check ownself. So don't worry, don't question, and don't complain. Everything will be solved in no time
Defects also got acceptable % ba
QC fail leh, so many trains out of the total purchase got defects...
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So far, it seems the defects are found only the 1st batch (model code C151A) which was in use since 2011.
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A 2nd batch (C151B) will start operating this year. This batch isn't listed in the HK's media report.
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C151B delivered last year - Also at night when traffic is light.
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Don't understand why the HK media consider this as "secret" .
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C151B will have new white livery.
V.S MY & INDON already must give way. What more its China here!!! I harbour little or no hope on SMRT seeking justice. More importantly, car lite policy how? No wonder sometime back its changed from disruption to interruption. Not good to use stronger words if foreseeable frequency of downtime is not rare.I am aware of the political reality of how big they are and how small we are.
But the way LTA has behaved does not ensure our national interest. It sends the signal that we can be bullied and we will swallow it.
It doesn't have to be diplomatic, just commercial - sorry but your products suck so we won't buy them anymore until you buck up.
Actually I feel that LTA is doing a good job. They did ownself check ownself, found out the problem and tried to find a solution themselves. They don't need to answer to the public because 70% have given them the mandate to ownself check ownself. So don't worry, don't question, and don't complain. Everything will be solved in no time
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in b4 saw chariot
Politically, I think covering up is bad strategy.
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Given the strong anti-China sentiments around the world these days, they could have come clean and blamed it on CSR Sifang. There will be some disquiet about LTA going for price over quality, but nothing like the saga they are facing today.
�
The thought of our officials having to protect other country reputation even after getting fleeced disgusts me.
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The more I read how this is covered by HK news, the more I sense that politics is involved.
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Not Singapore's politics, but that of HK's Press playing its influence overseas when reporting on PRC's businesses:
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Read the original report by FactWire - and you decide:
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Mainland manufacturer for MTR secretly recalls 35 trains from Singapore due to cracks
https://www.hongkong...ore-due-cracks/
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Chinese-made subway trains in Singapore have cracks in their car bodies and key structural components, resulting in 35 trains being shipped back to their manufacturer in Qingdao for replacement, FactWire can reveal.
Details of the defects and the recalls have been kept secret in both Singapore and China. The same mainland manufacturer is responsible for manufacturing nine trains for the Guangzhou-Shenzhen-Hong Kong Express Rail Link (XLR) and 93 trains for the Mass Transit Railway Corporation�s (MTR Corporation) four urban lines.
train tarp
Trains wrapped in green covering could be seen inside the factory in Chengyang district. Photo: FactWire.
A source from the mainland railway industry told FactWire that Singapore�s subway operator SMRT Trains Ltd (SMRT) was secretly shipping defective trains back to mainland China for replacement and repair by manufacturer CSR Sifang Locomotive & Rolling Stock Company Ltd� (CSR Sifang).
Hong Kong Free Press YouTube channel shows drone-footage of restricted zones at night over Singapore's port to capture the returning C151A carriages.
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Another HK TV news on Singapore's "secret" operation.
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So far, it seems the defects are found only the 1st batch (model code C151A) which was in use since 2011.
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A 2nd batch (C151B) will start operating this year. This batch isn't listed in the HK's media report.
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C151B delivered last year - Also at night when traffic is light.
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Don't understand why the HK media consider this as "secret" .
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C151B will have new white livery.
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B model coming in no need to wrap like ba zhang. A model RMA must wrap for "protection". So if wasn't intended to cover up, are you telling me that the new trains don't need to be protected but the old spoilt ones somehow need extra protection?
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Also, when LTA has new trains coming in, they make a big fuss out of the announcement but they say nothing when having to RMA 35 trains back? This is a big deal.
That Chinanese firm that collaborated w kawa, is it state owned and/or have strong links to the CCP?
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https://en.wikipedia...oration_Limited
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China South Locomotive & Rolling Stock Corporation Limited�(CSR) (SEHK:�1766,�SSE:�601766) was a�state-owned enterprise�supervised by the�State Council of the People's Republic of China.
Guessing because they have ordered from kawasaki since 1986, thot i read this somewhere
So maybe smrt didnt build up their technical knowledge or expertise in this area and needed them for this reason?
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If that's the truth then why bother to hold tender and wayang? Waste time and effort from other train makers.
B model coming in no need to wrap like ba zhang. A model RMA must wrap for "protection". So if wasn't intended to cover up, are you telling me that the new trains don't need to be protected but the old spoilt ones somehow need extra protection?
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Also, when LTA has new trains coming in, they make a big fuss out of the announcement but they say nothing when having to RMA 35 trains back? This is a big deal.
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https://en.wikipedia...oration_Limited
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China South Locomotive & Rolling Stock Corporation Limited�(CSR) (SEHK:�1766,�SSE:�601766) was a�state-owned enterprise�supervised by the�State Council of the People's Republic of China.
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If that's the truth then why bother to hold tender and wayang? Waste time and effort from other train makers.
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AFAIK, none of the incoming new MRT trains were ever wrap up like the returning ones, regardless of the vendors.
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That also includes the latest driver-less models from France to the 1st generation trains� in the 1980s - majority were moved during night time when traffic is light.
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In fact, this is the 1st known case of having trains being return and to suspect this is all "secret" operation because the carriages are wrap and moved during night time is to me nothing more than juicing up an "investigative" journalism.
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And by your reference that the contract involving "state own enterprise" is indeed, in line with what I had suspected about this HK-origin news - This is all about politics.
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B model coming in no need to wrap like ba zhang. A model RMA must wrap for "protection". So if wasn't intended to cover up, are you telling me that the new trains don't need to be protected but the old spoilt ones somehow need extra protection?
�
Also, when LTA has new trains coming in, they make a big fuss out of the announcement but they say nothing when having to RMA 35 trains back? This is a big deal.
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I believe there are cheaper and better ways to "protect" the trains as well. The way it is covered up doesn't look like it's for protection as much as it is to hide something.
Edited by Alheych, 07 July 2016 - 01:13 AM.
Why cannot they send the replacement trains then we send them back the defective trains?
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Sorry but trust usually doesn't rank very high on their agenda
AFAIK, none of the incoming new MRT trains were ever wrap up like the returning ones, regardless of the vendors.
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That also includes the latest driver-less models from France to the 1st generation trains� in the 1980s - majority were moved during night time when traffic is light.
�
In fact, this is the 1st known case of having trains being return and to suspect this is all "secret" operation because the carriages are wrap and moved during night time is to me nothing more than juicing up an "investigative" journalism.
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And by your reference that the contract involving "state own enterprise" is indeed, in line with what I had suspected about this HK-origin news - This is all about politics.
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There are many issues involved now - transparency, safety, security (arising from the drones)... I think foremost on people's minds is transparency. What are they trying to hide and who are they trying to protect? We should stay focused on this.
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I agree with you on the covers. See my previous post:
It's possible to say MSM knows about it but blackout etc... but I think the MSM was simply clueless about it. And this incident leaked because given the sheer number of people involved, there's no way it can remain a secret forever.
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Quite a bad place to be caught for MSM... if they know, they are conspirators; if they don't know, they are lousy journalists.
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The ones we should really be looking at are LTA and the train operators.�
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The way the trains are wrapped up looks like it is done to cover up the incident, not to protect the train from the elements - there are much quicker and cheaper ways to do it. Even when the trains were first delivered, they weren't wrapped up...
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I searched for past precedence and realised that all of our current running stock arrived without such cover:
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In chronological order, let's start with EW/NS lines:
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NE line:
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Circle line:
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Downtown line:
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Edited by Alheych, 07 July 2016 - 01:13 AM.
The more I read how this is covered by HK news, the more I sense that politics is involved.
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Not Singapore's politics, but that of HK's Press playing its influence overseas when reporting on PRC's businesses:
�
Read the original report by FactWire - and you decide:
�
�
Mainland manufacturer for MTR secretly recalls 35 trains from Singapore due to cracks
https://www.hongkong...ore-due-cracks/
�
Chinese-made subway trains in Singapore have cracks in their car bodies and key structural components, resulting in 35 trains being shipped back to their manufacturer in Qingdao for replacement, FactWire can reveal.
Details of the defects and the recalls have been kept secret in both Singapore and China. The same mainland manufacturer is responsible for manufacturing nine trains for the Guangzhou-Shenzhen-Hong Kong Express Rail Link (XLR) and 93 trains for the Mass Transit Railway Corporation�s (MTR Corporation) four urban lines.
train tarp
Trains wrapped in green covering could be seen inside the factory in Chengyang district. Photo: FactWire.
A source from the mainland railway industry told FactWire that Singapore�s subway operator SMRT Trains Ltd (SMRT) was secretly shipping defective trains back to mainland China for replacement and repair by manufacturer CSR Sifang Locomotive & Rolling Stock Company Ltd� (CSR Sifang).
�
yes I think that the HKG paper breaking the story may be politically-motivated.
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But we shouldn't let that distract us from the facts:
1) Cracks found�from July�2013; Returns started July 2014.
2) SG MSM, LTA, SMRT did not mention these defects, returns and refurbishments at all, until after the article was published by HKG.
3) Some LTA/SMRT staff would have been aware of this, but apparently kept the "secret" too.�No SMRTLeaks?
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so, let's keep our eyes on the pertinent issues, and not be distracted by the messenger.
It is a BIG COVER UP operation using all those canvas!
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Whoever selected and accepted the defective products must cum clean.....
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There are many issues involved now - transparency, safety, security (arising from the drones)... I think foremost on people's minds is transparency. What are they trying to hide and who are they trying to protect? We should stay focused on this.
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I agree with you on the covers. See my previous post:
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I agree there are several ways to see this report.
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However, I still fail to see how a foreign media should past this off as "secret" or lack of transparency simply based on how the train was wrapped up and� being return to the manufacturer ?
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Also what benefit LTA or SMRT will get by covering up a problem which isn't its making ?�
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To prevent any further erosion of public confidence with our railway ?
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This question is best asked by Singaporeans, not determined by foreign news media with their own political agenda...
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So lets' wait and see before passing quick judgement before all the facts are established.
�
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Despite multiple breakdowns and investigations and the problems starting FOUR YEARS ago has there been any announcements of this locally at all?I agree there are several ways to see this report.
However, I still fail to see how a foreign media should past this off as "secret" or lack of transparency simply based on how the train was wrapped up and being return to the manufacturer ?
Also what benefit LTA or SMRT will get by covering up a problem which isn't its making ?
To prevent any further erosion of public confidence with our railway ?
This question is best asked by Singaporeans, not determined by foreign news media with their own political agenda...
So lets' wait and see before passing quick judgement before all the facts are established.
When new trains come is announced big big.
I'd say there is definitive proof that there has been a "cover up"
AFAIK, none of the incoming new MRT trains were ever wrap up like the returning ones, regardless of the vendors.
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That also includes the latest driver-less models from France to the 1st generation trains� in the 1980s - majority were moved during night time when traffic is light.
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In fact, this is the 1st known case of having trains being return and to suspect this is all "secret" operation because the carriages are wrap and moved during night time is to me nothing more than juicing up an "investigative" journalism.
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And by your reference that the contract involving "state own enterprise" is indeed, in line with what I had suspected about this HK-origin news - This is all about politics.
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Politics or not, without it we are still in the dark about this and it happen since 2011.
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Two elections had gone by and we are kept in the dark.�
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Same goes with the AHGTC saga, without it we didn't know that a $2/- capital�company can bid for a multi million computer maintenance contract, didn't know that ceiling not clean could have a parliament hearing on it.��
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Wonder which is more serious : a few thousand dollars�ceiling cleaning vs hundreds over million dollars faulty trains.. 
With that line of argument.I agree there are several ways to see this report.
However, I still fail to see how a foreign media should past this off as "secret" or lack of transparency simply based on how the train was wrapped up and being return to the manufacturer ?
Also what benefit LTA or SMRT will get by covering up a problem which isn't its making ?
To prevent any further erosion of public confidence with our railway ?
This question is best asked by Singaporeans, not determined by foreign news media with their own political agenda...
So lets' wait and see before passing quick judgement before all the facts are established.
Our media reported:
Edward Snowden
Najib plenty stuff
Anwar and mahathir.
Indo palm fires and the companies
Corruption scandals all over.
Prc island building activities
You get the picture.
To say there's no cover up is really a stretch.
To shoot the messenger is being an ostrich.
interesting:
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For the town council, this remind me of how pap keep bring out on wp town council issue. When there is a slightest thing that they could catch, they will make it a big news. Minewhile their own backyard and also government agencies there is some problem, they try to cover up as much as possible. So it all boils down to politics isn't it?Politics or not, without it we are still in the dark about this and it happen since 2011.
Two elections had gone by and we are kept in the dark.
Same goes with the AHGTC saga, without it we didn't know that a $2/- capital company can bid for a multi million computer maintenance contract, didn't know that ceiling not clean could have a parliament hearing on it.
Wonder which is more serious : a few thousand dollars ceiling cleaning vs hundreds over million dollars faulty trains..
If lta were private company and with this kind of big recalls, I am 100% sure those who accept the tender and also many who are in charge of the project will be at the chopping board. It causes company to lose big money and private companies are not charity organization. Too bad lta is a government organization so any big mistake, these people still Bo dai ji continue working. This is the difference between how private and government organization runs. In a way, private organization actually runs more effectively then government as they need to see profit. Whereas government organization? Make a loss due to bad deal nevermind, it's tax payers money, can just ask government to fund in more money for help and also cover-up.
So kanna exposed is a good thing as end of the day it goes to do with tax payers money and we must ensure government organization runs like private organization like when there is so big bad investment or errors or loss involved, be prepared for chopping board. The better ones will take over.
Edited by Yewheng, 07 July 2016 - 07:54 AM.
"Secret" 'cos the trains are all wrapped up like bolster-shaped bak chang.
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This type of operation normally at night one, needs advance booking for police escort. So, this makes it even more "secret".
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I just can't imagine the trucking bills especially the cometto. It's like at least $50,000 per block of X hours per trip; thereafter $5,000 per hour or part of for demurrage.... something liddat....
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The cranes mobilised for lifting is another big ticket item.
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Total costs will be higher than ocean freight for sure.
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So far, it seems the defects are found only the 1st batch (model code C151A) which was in use since 2011.
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A 2nd batch (C151B) will start operating this year. This batch isn't listed in the HK's media report.
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C151B delivered last year - Also at night when traffic is light.
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Don't understand why the HK media consider this as "secret" .
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C151B will have new white livery.
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Lol.. They are not Amazon.CN leh.... Don't have the same returns policy as Amazon.com lah..�
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On a more serious note. It's a cover up mah, and the returned trains are supposed to be cannabalised for �brand new trains to be built. Apparently the defects are extensive enough that whole train cannot be repaired. No safety issue?!�
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Why cannot they send the replacement trains then we send them back the defective trains?
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Sorry but trust usually doesn't rank very high on their agenda
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ayah sgh hepc case also nobody got indicted. dom sarron lee die even better no court case.
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basically we just behave n be good doggies ok? eat your food, por your master lumpa n all is well
The strategy is to try and make this about foreign interference in domestic matters and the drone in restricted areaWith that line of argument.
Our media reported:
Edward Snowden
Najib plenty stuff
Anwar and mahathir.
Indo palm fires and the companies
Corruption scandals all over.
Prc island building activities
You get the picture.
To say there's no cover up is really a stretch.
To shoot the messenger is being an ostrich.
The strategy is to try and make this about foreign interference in domestic matters and the drone in restricted area
Darn, I just praised u. Indeed, confusion is often the best�alternative medicine�of confession. ![[laugh]](https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/blogger_img_proxy/AEn0k_s4vvGQ9Rv_sETtDD40DBAy8Bi-YoSnAUjXcJ9A950Nobav1SwqDUCidhD5IRd7PvV1XDllKlcXBVg26xS73ttn0h2BUHY3teQ5Or-fOdcr0KcgDr4fAWaRx8PQM2PCxT62o-yhXA=s0-d)
Edited by Weez911, 07 July 2016 - 09:20 AM.
"Secret" 'cos the trains are all wrapped up like bolster-shaped bak chang.
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This type of operation normally at night one, needs advance booking for police escort. So, this makes it even more "secret".
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I just can't imagine the trucking bills especially the cometto. It's like at least $50,000 per block of X hours per trip; thereafter $5,000 per hour or part of for demurrage.... something liddat....
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The cranes mobilised for lifting is another big ticket item.
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Total costs will be higher than ocean freight for sure.
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Do not wory so much. One fare hike will resolve all these issues. Sup sup water lah.
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Must get more ppl to give up their cars so that they can get more from the fare hike. Support car-lite city, yo.
if ownself reported first ... probably can sugarcoat the message and manage expectations/reactions
why must wait until hk media pecah lobang ... when someone pecah lobang ...
no matter how it's already in bad publicity ...
![[mad]](https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/blogger_img_proxy/AEn0k_toIDERnBaiyrutBCPHWMlYksFVW7l5qthfxCdCYrzEf4-3EnaiHlF6uceuC-ynyRatuawwBAU85bugz9mLu3twj59WcM3vfUEQIIonkm_S1AhUDTOuRcVfexiLhOqzwlUTUGs=s0-d)
in today edge of new media and internet ... they still believe can cover up?
they think sinkies only read ST and watch ch 5 news? muahahaha
Edited by Wt_know, 07 July 2016 - 09:21 AM.
Do not wory so much. One fare hike will resolve all these issues. Sup sup water lah.
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Must get more ppl to give up their cars so that they can get more from the fare hike. Support car-lite city, yo.
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yup...those retard will do so on the hike...just like carparks...so wtf are all those being paid millions a year and have the cheek to try and cover up..no wonder we are 154th in transparency...enuf said.
Sorry . . I just came back from Mars. Si mi dai ji this LTA thingy?
![[confused]](https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/blogger_img_proxy/AEn0k_u14OLVfn2Cl9KueI9bKfSPf-UzCNu9XBw1DqxM3CkazmtIAmgnY1JCov3SE01bK4wQ4Vpp4VQ3Hf4heM0MNfgoEYdCDYGKD3x3vv0yOo-11Z7xsS_YXOEu6DXnFZLpKWgQQj76V4m0=s0-d)
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I must start reading from the start of this saga when I have the time
Edited by Count-Bracula, 07 July 2016 - 09:32 AM.
Sorry . . I just came back from Mars. Si mi dai ji this LTA thingy?
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I must start reading from the start of this saga when I have the time
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liddat you shd go back to UR-anus then...closer to MARS
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